Two glasses of cider and mermaids writing messages in the sand.

No, this isn’t the beginning of a Yorgos Lanthimos movie, but a very simplified summary of this interview.

After a photoshoot with Mary Malone, during which I looked with admiration at her grace and sensuality, we sat at the table of a pub, drinking cider, and talking about how, when we were kids, we both used to ask to the sea and to the mermaids to come and take us, whispering to them in the salty water and writing messages in the grains of sand.

I met Mary to talk about the new hit Netflix TV series “Missing You”, where she plays Aqua, a key character whom I instantly fell in love with. So, when we came here in London, we couldn’t miss the opportunity to interview her.

Together, we talked about how we can—and should—rewrite the narrative of trans women, and how acting can be a way to do that. And we also talked about how sometimes isolating yourself can be a means for survival. The most inspiring thing I realized in that moment, or we realized together, is how much the little girls we once were would have needed a hug from the women we are now, and most of all, they would have needed us, as we are today.

Between a sip of cider (yes, I swear, I liked it) and a chat about Miranda July’s books, I can confidently say that the interview with Mary is one of those important ones that will stay with me forever.

I like to start with this question: what’s your first cinema memory? When did your passion begin?

The most vivid first memory that I have is of when I used to go on family holidays to Cornwall, to seaside towns, and specifically, I remember a little town called Padstow where there’s this tiny little old-school cinema. I don’t know if it even still is there. I hope it is, but I remember going there with my family and watching “Mamma Mia”. For me, it was the magic of cinema – not just the film, but the experience of the room, which felt ancient and magical, and it felt like theater but with a screen.

The first thing that spurred passion in me might have been the David Lynch films: when I first watched them, I felt very inspired by the level at which films could grow creatively. That blew my mind, the realization of what films can be.

They are pure magic. I do this job also because I love cinema. It’s my medicine: sometimes it can make you feel worse, but there is a reason for it.
What makes you say yes to a project?

For me, right now, where I’m at in my career, I don’t want any clunky trans narratives. The first thing I’m always looking for is to figure out if the character is specifically trans or if I’m seen for more, for women, generally. I’m always looking to get away from the clunky trans narratives that are not written by trans people: I’m looking for stories that move me, or make me laugh, I’m looking for roles that feel empowering, that positively reflect trans people. I’m no activist and I’m not trying to change the world, but I know where I can make changes through my acting. I get excited about playing roles that I would want to see someone like me play or that I would have needed to see growing up. You know, sometimes things just stick, and if I find myself daydreaming about a role, and imagining it and who that person is, it’s the right one. Sometimes, it’s a role that’s close to me, but I also love to do very transformative things as well. I’ve always been someone who plays totally different parts, and that’s always really exciting.

“I’m no activist and I’m not trying to change the world, but I know where I can make changes through my acting.”

I always ask this question because I find it interesting, the fact that you play so many different roles, and so you get to understand the people you are portraying, which I think means you also do a lot of work on yourself: is there something new you’ve learned about yourself through this process?

Yeah. It sounds really corny, but the big thing that I learned about myself concerns believing in myself. Looking back at something like “Missing You”, I’ve learned that I’m more capable than I think I am. Among the roles or the people that I’ve embodied, Aqua’s a tough one; she’s so loyal and thoughtful of other people, and she showed me how secrets eat you up and how you can’t bear your things forever, and everything always finds a way out.

As you said, Aqua carries a very big secret, and sometimes I think that if you do, you can be lonely. Aqua, for example, was spending less time with Kat because she couldn’t cope with her secret. Do you ever feel the need to be alone? Is solitude something that you reach for or something you tend to stay away from?

I’d say it’s something that I reach for, but it’s not necessarily what I want to do. For my whole life, I’ve used isolation as a means to survive, and it’s been a safe place for me. But I’m finding more and more that I want to step outside of that and connect with people and the world because there’s safety in being alone, but loneliness will just eat you out.

Sometimes, I really need to isolate myself, maybe also because of my job, where I constantly meet so many people. Plus, I’m very empathetic, which is good, but it can also be bad because I take on people’s stuff.

I think it’s a good thing to be able to do it, not everyone is empathetic.

“For my whole life, I’ve used isolation as a means to survive…”

I hope so, but I also think that sometimes it’s too much, and I take care of my mental health a lot. Connection is one of the reasons why I do this job anyway, but at the same time, I also need to take some moments to be alone.

I’m more the other way, I will sit in the space and actively be like, “Ok, now we need to see our friends, we need to leave the house, we need to leave the bed”.

But also, I’ve realized that my job is such high exposure, and as a trans person in the world, I get a lot of attention, which is not wrong, sometimes I want that, but sometimes I need not to have that, I need to not be witnessed, looked at, perceived – it feels safe to not have those eyes on me. I’m not performing, you know; even in life, sometimes, it can feel like a performance, it can feel like my job, it can feel like I’m looking at people and trying to catch pieces of them – so I’ve learned that my isolating is a necessary part of me, regulating myself, I suppose.

When you approach a character, do you tend to be more rational or emotional?

I love this question. I think it’s a bit of both, but my first instincts are always emotional. I always feel things first in my body, and I think about where that emotion is in me. Those are my first impulses, and then I will sit down and look at the story and focus on what’s important and how I should tell the story. But then, sometimes, that all goes out of the window once I’m on set with another actor.

I think I do my best work when I feel that I’m emotionally free and not estranged by an irrational plan I’ve made for this character because sometimes you surprise yourself when you’re with someone.

What was your first thought when you read the script of “Missing You”?

It was a journey because it came to me in pieces. I started with a couple of sides for the audition, and those didn’t make it into the series.

I remember the first read-through: we had episodes 1-3, and I thought, “Okay, this is a lot more emotional depth than I first thought, this is a little bit intimidating and also exciting”. After reading episode 3, we started shooting, and we didn’t have episodes 4 and 5, so it was like just people watching it and not knowing what was coming next! [read]

But you know, a lot of us had read the book and I thought, “My character’s got a huge secret, I can’t do episodes 1- 3 if I don’t know. How is this going to end for her?”. So, I learned about what happens, but I didn’t actually see those scripts until we finished filming, which is crazy. That was fun [laughs]. That was tricky, but also kind of a fun challenge. We got to go on the ride like everyone else, I guess.

And it’s going so fucking well!

Yeah, it’s actually crazy, it’s gone better than I could have dreamed. So, I’m super grateful and just, I can’t believe it.

In the last episode, Aqua said, “You have the right to be true to yourself”. What does this mean to you?

I think it means that we deserve to live our truest and most authentic lives. If I think about what’s happening there for Aqua, before she says that line, she says something like, “I know you love them”, as in, “I know you love your family, I know you love them, but you have the right to be true to yourself”. So, she’s kind of saying that you can’t pretend to be someone else for other people and that no one has the right to tell you who you are. It really speaks to me, and I’ve been there in my own life.

My whole sense of self is built upon what other people want me to be or think I am, so, I guess Aqua’s wisdom translates to, “You have the right to be who you are and no one else has the right to tell you who to be”.

“you can’t pretend to be someone else for other people”

Yeah. And how and where do you find inspiration on the job and in your everyday life?

I am constantly inspired by my community, that’s my main source of inspiration: all the incredibly strong, resilient trans women who have come before me and the trans women who continue to thrive. You know, this world is not built for us to succeed, so, the fact that there are so many of us really slaying and killing it is so inspiring. It really makes you feel like you can do it. Also, I suffer from a lot of imposture syndrome: obviously, growing up trans, you just don’t see yourself there. So, when I look to everyone else and even my community at home and the people who love me, that inspires me because it’s not just me, what I’m doing is for them, it’s for all of us. Just seeing other queer and trans people on set is so uplifting and inspiring, and I hope to see more of it, not only trans actors and performers but also writers or crew or the creative team.

You also have a theatre background. Are there any productions you did or roles that have impacted your approach to everything?

Yes. The one that springs to mind is my professional theatre debut. It was a play called “The Prince” and I played a character called Jen, a protagonist in the story. The show was about basically a bunch of characters trapped inside Shakespeare’s plays and they couldn’t escape. It begins with some intense Shakespeare scenes and the whole audience was there, nodding their head, trying to get on the Shakespeare bits like they knew what was going on, and then my first line was something like, “I didn’t understand a word of that”. So, Jen didn’t know what was going on, she was so open and free, and I really loved playing that role, I would say it really encouraged me to take up space on stage and be free and connect and look at the audience right in the eye and really be there.

The audience followed that character so much and I guess I was celebrated a lot for that role and I’ve taken that with me, thinking, “Okay, cool, the audience is always there with me if I let them in”.

That’s great. And you have also played in a lot of short films, which I think is a very different experience. We have a small film production company because Johnny, our photographer and art director, is also a filmmaker. We made a documentary, for example, and so I’m curious to know about your experience because I guess with a long feature film, you can take the time to let the audience understand your character, while in a short movie, you have less time to make them empathize with you. Is it more difficult or different?

I mean, it is different. In short films, I often try and take the character closest to myself really quickly, as close to myself as possible, so that it doesn’t feel out of my reach. If it’s within me to be this person, then all the details of that person live within me already and it kind of feels like a real person. So, that’s normally how I approach roles, but then sometimes something comes along that’s so different from you, of course.

I’ve done some short films where I have had quite intense rehearsal processes, which have been really useful. I did a short film called “Scaffold”, for example, where we had quite intense rehearsals, and then we filmed in a very isolated and dramatic house on the very edge of a cliff in Wales, near the sea, a high drama, beautiful, stunning, and also terrifying place. And I guess that helps too, right? When you step on set and that’s the world you’re going to be in, it’s there and it’s real and you’re like, “Okay, I don’t need anything”. Anyway, it is definitely more of a challenge that I’ve not thought about.

It has been a luxury filming “Missing You”, and sitting back and enjoying it, while I feel like short films are very fast, and you don’t get a chance to take it in.

What’s your favourite genre to play and your favourite one to watch?

My favourite to play is comedy, I think. Not that I’ve got to do lots of it for the screen. I’ve done a lot of comedy for theatre, but I’d like to do more for the screen, I think that’s where I naturally sit, although I’ve been doing a lot of drama.

And my favourite things to watch are probably dramas. I like dark things, I love horror, a little bit of spooky, dark and moving stuff that are really cathartic to watch.

Since “Missing You” has been such a hit (I watched it in one afternoon), what was your latest binge-watch?

The truth is, I’m completely and utterly obsessed with “The Real Housewives”.

I was really unwell over Christmas, and I’m not going to lie to you, I binged the whole season of “The Real Housewives of Atlanta” in a day. And anyone who’s seen that season knows it’s absolutely iconic. This is my tea, that’s my truth.

But there’s also an amazing Spanish series called “Veneno” by the Javier brothers on the life of Cristina La Veneno, and it is something I’ve seen before but continue to binge and continue to go back to. It features three trans actresses who play her through her whole life, and it’s just nothing I’ve ever seen before. I really recommend it to anyone who’s not watched it.

I need to watch it.

And what’s the thing that makes you laugh the most?

Alex Consani. She’s an incredible supermodel, she won Model of the Year, and she’s also the craziest, most goofy, insane, feral person I’ve ever seen in my life. Her TikToks are bonkers, I just rewatch them daily. Nothing makes me barely laugh like her; I’m low-key desperate to be her best friend.

In this world dominated by social media like TikTok, Instagram, etcetera, everything is really going so fast, it’s crazy out there. Sometimes I think that things go too fast. Do you ever feel overwhelmed? How do you cope with that?

I do feel overwhelmed. I get sucked into the void of just consuming everything all the time, and only recently have I noticed how much that affects me. I cope with that by limiting my time on social media. I felt like I wasn’t consenting to all the shit that was being forced down my throat, and I started to notice that it’s not even like watching a video, it’s more like you have to scroll past it to get to the next one, and the flicker of what you’ve seen enters your body and affects you. I deal with it by just trying to be present, which continues to be a challenge for me. I’ve started yoga recently, and it has actually been quite life-changing because I don’t know how often I’m present in my body.

I’ve realized that when I’m present in my body, that’s the only way I can feel like I can slow things down and ground myself. So, my coping mechanism is connecting to my body, focusing on that, and being in nature, obviously, which is always the best thing ever.

And you grew up in the countryside.

Yeah, I grew up in Suffolk, a very rural place. I would frequently walk through forests and fields, and it’s beautiful there, it’s something that I find I really miss in London. I’ve recently been spending more time near the sea, which has really changed me. My nervous system is totally different: you just have space suddenly, it’s amazing.

What would you tell your younger self?

I’m still trying to figure that out. I think I would tell her that she’s safe to feel anger. I think anger is something that a lot of people don’t learn to feel but rather suppress.

I’d say, “Little Mary, don’t go anywhere. It’s enough”. I would tell her to feel her anger and to validate that there’s a lot to be angry about. I would tell her she’s not responsible for everyone else and obviously that she’s worthy of love, and there’s a lot of love and community to come.

You know, once my therapist asked me to imagine myself when I was younger and to hug myself because I was giving my younger self all the responsibility for everything, thinking it was all her fault, I was looking at her like she was rubbish. When I started to understand that whatever happened wasn’t my fault, I was like, “Ok, I can live better now, I love her, there’s nothing to forgive her for”.

Isn’t it so powerful that the person to come and give us what we need or have always been looking for is yourself? That’s so moving when I think about it. I think about myself younger and what she needed, but it’s actually like she needed me. Now, I’m the one to save myself. It’s very moving.

“Isn’t it so powerful that the person to come and give us what we need or have always been looking for is yourself?”

On another note, what’s your most remarkable acting rebellion?

Living visibly as a trans person in a world that is so hostile towards us. Getting out of bed and stepping out the door and existing in the world.

And what’s your biggest fear? And when do you feel safe?

My biggest fear is loneliness. And I feel most safe with animals.

Yeah. I have a cat who is my son.

What’s his name?

Blue. You know, now that I’m here in London for one week, I’m asking my friend to take care of him. He really is my baby.

Yeah, I’m desperate for a pet, I really need one. Animals are everything, and they’re not asking you for anything. So, I feel safe with animals, in nature, and definitely by the sea and in water, which is quite ironic because the ocean is so scary, but, actually, I feel so safe when I’m in the sea. This is kind of a silly story, but growing up, I always believed I was going to meet mermaids in the water, and they were going to take me…

Oh God, I thought the same!

Really? We’re mermaids. We’re secret mermaids. I used to dream that they would come, and they would take me away to their world, and it was safe there.

Water is my favourite element.

Did you grow up near water?

No, actually.

Me neither. And that’s why we need it. We’re craving it.

Yeah, whenever I’m near the ocean or the sea, I’m in peace. And when I was a little girl, I was searching for mermaids!

We were both searching for mermaids? That breaks my heart. You know, I remember I used to write down in the sand and on the cliffs letters to them and I’d be like, “Come and get me”. I was just convinced I was a mermaid. I was a bit obsessed with them. Mermaids for me are such a powerful image of femininity, but in a slightly ferocious and powerful way.

Are you reading any books right now?

Yes. I’ve actually just started a book by a writer that I absolutely adore and love: “All Fours” by Miranda July. It’s so fucking good, so quirky, but so human. The author is so honest and vulnerable and shows so much honesty… I can’t wait to read more. I don’t know if you’ve read any of her books, but there’s one called “First Bad Man”, which is so good.

I read “All Fours” too, I loved it. I read a collection of Miranda July’s short stories, “No One Belongs Here More Than You”.

Yes, that one’s so good. I think she is the best at exploring the longing connection and how we get in the way of it all the time, I’m constantly fascinated by that, and she articulates it so well.

Is there a song that describes this moment in your life?

Yeah, it’s funny because it actually came up while we were doing our photo shoot. My song right now is “Landslide” by Stevie Nicks. I guess I’m just going through a lot of change and learning about everything I’ve gone through to get here, learning to rely on myself and move through incredible change.

Are you more like a nocturnal animal or an early bird?

Oh, my God, I love this question. I’m a night owl. I can stay up so late and I love to stay up late, I feel like I’m owed time from the day. I’m like, “This is my time, I’m going to stay up late because I need to do all the things I actually want to do because while I was awake in the day, I didn’t do the things I wanted to do”. Also, once it hits midnight, I am ravenous for food, for snacks, specifically, sometimes I’m up in the night at the fridge eating snacks. When I go back into bed, my partner will always ask me, “What have you eaten?”.

He’s an early bird, so it’s kind of a bit fucked for us, but I teach him a bit about the magic of the night, and he teaches me that sunrise is the most beautiful thing. He’s by the sea, so we get up really early and go sit by the sea and watch the sunrise, and think, “Wow. It’s no one else’s, it’s all mine” because that’s how it feels.

What does it mean for you to feel comfortable in your skin?

I’m not totally sure. I don’t always feel comfortable in my skin, but I think I feel the most comfortable in my skin when I am present in my environment, so, if I’m in nature and I’m present, or I’m dancing and I’m in my body. Somehow, by being so present and in my body, I become less aware of myself and I’m here, now, alive and comfortable in my skin. But I’m still working on that. We’re all still, I think, trying to figure that one out.

And what’s home for you?

I’m learning that home is in my body because that’s the only place I’m always going to be and can rely on to be there for me.

Directed by Johnny Carrano.

Makeup & Hair by Nohelia Reyes.

Styling by Rachel Davis.

Thanks to Prosper PR & Thrive Talent.

LOOK 1

Coat: The Frankie Shop

Top: Agent Provocateur

Skirt: Milo Maria

Tights: Tabio

Shoes: Kalda

LOOK 2

Top and Shorts: Samanta Virgino

Tights: Falke